Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign.
[00:00:05] Speaker B: Welcome to another episode of the Worst Advice I Ever Got brought to you by Smith and Howard.
I'm your host, Sean Taylor, along with my producer, JB. Today, our guest is Dr. Jimmy Moly. Jimmy is a sports psychiatrist who works with athletes at every level. He helps them navigate the mental side of competition, performance, injuries, and ultimately life transitions both during and after their playing careers.
Jimmy studied at Notre Dame, completed medical school and psychiatry, however, at the Ohio State University, and now focuses his work on the psychological challenges that come with high performance in sports. So, Jimmy, welcome to the show.
[00:00:43] Speaker C: Hey, thank you very much for having me.
[00:00:45] Speaker B: So, on this show, we always start in the same place. We just ask this simple question, what's the worst advice you ever got?
[00:00:52] Speaker C: Thank you. And you know, in short, the worst advice I ever got was, you know, many people saying to me, you know, it's all in your head. And really this idea of what is the interplay between mental health and athletics, it's interesting.
[00:01:04] Speaker B: It's all in your head, right? Growing up in athletics, I played. My father was a four sport athlete in high school. My son played collegiate level sports. And I'm quite sure I've heard this said multiple times, right. You know, you've probably said it to him, you know, and I hear, man,
[00:01:21] Speaker A: it's in your head, dude, don't worry about it.
[00:01:23] Speaker B: It's all in your head, man. You're fine, you're fine. So, so what, what happens, you know, Jimmy, when, when, when someone hears it's all in your head or what have you seen in your experience?
[00:01:33] Speaker C: Yeah, well, usually it's, it's set at a moment of struggle, right. A moment of adversity. It's when, when an athlete can't overcome a challenge, right. For whatever reason. So the classic example I think of is baseball, right, with the yips. Right. Or golfing with putting or individual based sports. Right. I think some famous examples like Rick and Keel, right, for the Cardinals, where there seems to be some sort of mental block. Right, Right. And this idea that, well, there's, there's no physical issues, right? So the only thing left, it has to be all in your head. It's almost said in a way that, you know, makes the mental health seem secondary, seem less than important, right. Or seem like it's just something to be overcome. Like, why can't you get over this? Right?
[00:02:11] Speaker A: Yeah, it's in your, it's just, it's, it's not like it's not only it's all in your head, it's, it's just in your head. So why are you even letting this affect you physically at all? You know, there's a secondary part to that that makes you feel weak for even letting it affect you at all.
[00:02:26] Speaker C: Yeah, it's such a loaded statement, right. It comes with decades of stigma around mental health. Just kind of loaded into that one phrase. Right. And it makes you feel like, hey, if I can't overcome this, you know, what, what's wrong with me? There must be some inherent problem, you know, with how I'm hardwired. Or maybe this isn't, you know, maybe I'm not cut out for whatever task you're facing. And it really, you know, instead of promoting mental health as a tool, as something to be used to, to gain an advantage, to, to enjoy all of the benefits of sport, it. It really shines a negative light on it and says, hey, this is something to be fixed. Only then once you get through this, we can get back to all right, now what's the, the real thing? We're here.
[00:03:00] Speaker A: The real thing. Yeah. Right.
[00:03:02] Speaker B: Jimmy, who's delivering this message? Who's saying this to athletes?
[00:03:07] Speaker C: Well, that's the thing too. So, you know, I work in, in mental health and athletics and there's so many different, what we call stakeholders, and these are individuals or even sometimes groups that have an investment in the outcome of an athlete's performance.
So this looks a lot of times like coaches, parents, trainers, support staffs, teachers. Right. And those are all the people in the immediate athlete kind of ecosystem. But especially now 20, 26. Right. That's just blown up too in the, in the era of social media. Right. Everything.
[00:03:36] Speaker A: The media narrative.
[00:03:37] Speaker C: Yeah, right. I mean, the feedback loop now is so short. Right. Everything you do is out on the Internet or out there instantly, especially as you get up into the higher levels of competition. So I think part of the issue with this statement and this types of, this type of advice is that it just comes from so many different angles. Sometimes it's almost confusing or dizz being to try to respond to.
[00:03:57] Speaker A: Are you still seeing it as. As much as it was, you know, 10, 12 years ago? Like are we still or are people kind of coming around to this is a harmful thing to say, you know, it's better.
[00:04:09] Speaker C: I would say we've definitely made a lot of strides. I don't mean to discount that. And I mean, you think back, I think that the Kevin Love story Now is almost 10 years ago. Right. Other high profile athletes, Simone Biles, Michael Phelps, even recently, just a few days ago, Lauren Betts for ucla and The NCAA tournament, right. These stories are out there, and I think that in some way reduces the stigma, reduces some of the barriers, but we also have so far to go.
[00:04:31] Speaker B: You know what, though, Jimmy? I, I, I think I agree with you. Right. We're talking about it more, it's gaining more notoriety, more press.
But I kind of liken it to the tip of the iceberg, right? Because how many people are maybe hearing that superficially but not doing anything about it? I mean, a lot of the reaction these athletes get are, you know, oh, poor thing, like, suck it up like you're an Olympic athlete. Like it's still being stated. I'm really interested to know what happens when an athlete is told this. Do they take it in and how do they process it and what do they do with it?
[00:05:04] Speaker C: That's a great question, and there's not one, I would say typical response, but I would say what we tend to see most frequently, right. Is our athletes really internalizing a lot of their struggle. I talk a lot about this idea of kind of internal versus external symptoms and displays of mental health. Right. So what I mean by internalizing an idea is, is they really, you know, they tend to isolate, they tend to keep it to themselves. There's a lot of guilt, a lot of self blame, a lot of self criticism that's involved with that. And athletes are used to hearing criticism, right. Coaching from all levels, all the way up. But this idea that you can be kind of your own worst enemy, kind of beat yourself up about things and, you know, it becomes more than of just a game of fighting against yourself. You're already fighting the opponent, the challenge, whatever you're facing. Right? But fighting against yourself, I think, is probably the most common response. Which, again, is the exact opposite, Right. Of what we're trying to accomplish with saying that, hey, mental health should be more accessible and a tool that everyone can, can reach for, right?
[00:05:59] Speaker B: Yeah. The simplicity of the message is, get it out of your head, right? Like it's in your head, so get it out. So what, what happens if they don't? What is the fear that they're going through? Right, J.B. that's kind of what you're getting at, right?
[00:06:10] Speaker A: Exactly. Yeah.
[00:06:12] Speaker C: Yeah. And it just, the problem is too, then it becomes so uncomfortable that what I see on the back end is a lot of athletes seeking to cope externally. And that looks like things like maybe substance abuse, right? That looks like sometimes things like eating disorders, you know, gambling disorders, things that, that temporarily offer some sort of relief, some sort of hit of, you know, Anxiety relief. But in the end, obviously, we know our, our generally destructive behaviors. So that, that's. The other side is there are definitely negative consequences of these, of these statements, of these ideas that are pretty now pervasive, unfortunately, in athletic culture.
[00:06:45] Speaker A: Well, especially the one we were saying, like, how prevalent, you know, the, the social media is in the thing. And, you know, people have been talking a long time about, you know, SATs and how competitive it is to get into college and all these things. So showing a weakness in any kind of way, even a perceived one, when you're going up against the entire world going for, you know, the 15 D1 scholarships that they offer, you know what I mean? Like, maybe you lose playing time, maybe you're letting your teammates down, you're doing your things. This is gonna make you be like, oh, well, now I'm soft, I'm not mentally tough, and I'm gonna lose something if I do that. Are you seeing people kind of with those fears?
[00:07:19] Speaker C: Oh, of course, yeah. I think there, there's this pervasive attitude that being an athlete means one thing, and that's, you know, 1,000% dedication, hard work, intensity all the time. Right. And we see this at all levels of sport. But, but in reality, I mean, a lot of the work I do requires, you know, balance, requires nuance, requires considering different ideas and trying to hold those at the same time. And, and I think that helps prevent burnout. It helps enhance performance in a lot of ways. But it is very counterintuitive, right, to the general societal narratives about what it means to be a high level athlete.
[00:07:51] Speaker B: Being an athlete is, is your identity. So if you're going through challenges and struggles now, it's not just about the sport. Right. It's about who you are. Is that a fair statement, Jimmy?
[00:08:02] Speaker C: Absolutely. Yeah. A vast majority of the work I do involves work around identity. And what does it mean to not only be an athlete, but, you know, maybe in the case of your son, like, what does it mean to be a student athlete? What does it mean to be part of a friend group, a family member? Right. These are all different identities that we all have every day. We don't always think about them, but they're always in the background.
What happens though, when a single one of those identities like a student athlete just really overtakes everything? Right. Well, it just puts a lot of pressure on that one identity. Then any threat to that identity, either real or perceived, just becomes so much more significant, so much more catastrophic when things fall apart.
[00:08:40] Speaker A: Yeah. Anything you're doing, if I'M not good at this. I'm not good at anything. The. You're equating this. If I'm mentally soft, if I can't play, then what am I? What I even do? Do you find it difficult to get somebody to buy into this who is like the high performing at the highest level, doing the best things? Because a lot of it is sort of like preparing yourself for the worst. Right. I think that's what people think about. And they're like, I don't even want to think about that. Right. I just want to be at a high level. But you're. You do have the ability to go through this and talk about it and be wildly successful at whatever sport you choose, right?
[00:09:14] Speaker C: For sure. And, you know, I think a lot of times by the time they come to see me, they've probably already had some of those thoughts. Like, it's already gotten to that point where I see the most issue are the people who are not really seeking this kind of help. Right. The folks who, you know, they kind of have the blinders on, so to speak, and which, hey, I mean, I understand, like, it's an adaptive response to a highly competitive environment. Right. But that, unfortunately, is the downside that, you know, eventually does catch up with a lot of folks one way or another.
[00:09:39] Speaker A: Yeah, you have to. It's that old Moneyball line, Sean. The. We're all told at some point that we can no longer play the children's game. Like, some of us are told at 18, some of us are told at 40, but we're all told, you know, so it's like, what are you gonna do next? You know, what's. How are you gonna handle it?
[00:09:54] Speaker B: But hasn't the mental strength of athletes become a big part of those who are wildly successful? So we're kind of coming at this from the angle of, you know, it's all in your head. You're struggling. Fix it. I know there's stories out there. I think John Smoltz used to use a, you know, somebody to help him, and the guy actually sat behind the. The catcher, you know, during games when he was pitching. And I think Tiger woods success is extremely physical, but also mental. How do you see that play into action? Jimmy?
[00:10:27] Speaker C: There are these ideas that, that mental skills can lead to performance optimization. And that's the space of, like, that's the mental wellness space. Right? That's the side where, you know, I find a lot of joy in too, working with folks on, hey, how can we. How can we tweak this, refine this right? Use these tools to help get you there for sure. And I think that has shifted over the years. So I think before, maybe previously, kind of the classic trope is, like, Kobe Bryant, like, that ability, mental ability, right. To completely lock in, to block everything else out and to be so 100% dedicated to your craft.
I think now the examples we're seeing are maybe a bit more nuanced, right? Where there's ideas of, like you said, using maybe breath work, of using visual visualization. Those are seen now as things that actually help set you apart.
[00:11:10] Speaker A: Yeah, I think that's the thing that I'm taking away, that I want to make sure people are hearing, is that you can do this. This will. This will actually make you maybe better at the sport that you're playing. This is not something that is like a crutch or a thing. Like, this is actually how to. Especially if you can get out ahead of this, you know, before you start being Chuck Knobloch and throwing the ball into the middle of the ground, you know, you can get ahead of these
[00:11:29] Speaker C: sort of now and that. And that's the whole idea, right? It's all in your head right there. In a lot of ways, you know, there are things in your head that can help enhance athletic performance. So just the nuance of it, right, of understanding how do we kind of thread that needle between, you know, using. Acknowledging the mental realities of sport and leveraging them for success, while also acknowledging that there are other aspects that we want to include that as one tool of many.
[00:11:52] Speaker B: You're. You're aging yourself there, jb. Pulling.
[00:11:55] Speaker A: I know as soon as I said Chuck Knobloch, I was like, now everybody knows I'm older.
[00:12:00] Speaker B: I was gonna, I was gonna up you by. By going with Steve Sachs. But that's our.
[00:12:04] Speaker A: Oh, yeah, okay. You know, that's okay. Yeah, you would have.
[00:12:06] Speaker B: Jimmy, I'm curious.
What are signs that an athlete might be struggling in these moments but not really saying anything? Because for someone to give the advice, it's all in your head. There has to have been a moment where an athlete has said something. Right. But.
[00:12:20] Speaker C: Right.
[00:12:20] Speaker B: I, I, I'm wondering whether there are signs that they're struggling but not really letting. Letting you in as an outsider into what's going on in their head. Do you see that happening with athletes?
[00:12:31] Speaker C: For sure. For sure. And it can take different flavors. Right. It can kind of go in multiple directions. So, you know, what I've seen a lot is actually sometimes even maybe counterintuitive, but kind of this idea of, like, over Training. Right. Or really kind of pushing maybe above one's limit and things of that nature where you're really burning yourself way beyond what is considered beneficial. Right. And it's a way to kind of chase after something that maybe doesn't exist.
A lot of times, you know, people think that I have some sort of magic ability, right, to transfer skills or, or to give people this, this automatic advice. But in a lot of ways, it's helping just be a guide for folks, a guide for athletes to, to really discover parts of themselves that they maybe didn't know were there, needed a little bit more development. And then at those end stages like we talked about before now, how do we build up skills? How do we optimize? How do we really leverage these things to your advantage both on and off the playing field?
[00:13:22] Speaker B: Interesting. And I guess along with that is processing maybe the loss of that athlete identity. Right. Like, are there certain things that you help athletes do in, in order to cope with that?
[00:13:38] Speaker C: Yeah, so I, I do a lot of, like, grief therapy work, and I treat a lot of these things like grief processes. Right. So, you know, kind of we classically have the five stages of grief, you know, denial, acceptance, bargaining, depression, and acceptance. And this idea that, you know, we have to work through those and realize that maybe there's a version of yourself that has, in a way, kind of died and moved on. But then hopefully we can make that shift to now, hey, this is a creative process. You get to design, you know, the rest of your life. Right. How do we take your skills that you learned maybe at a, you know, Division 1 level, and how do we translate that into success? And how do we channel a lot of the things that you loved about sport now to the rest of your life?
[00:14:16] Speaker A: What are some of those mental skills that sort of get people, you know, here's what I'm going to teach you to do. That can actually, you know, not only for the athletes that are trying to get ahead of it to improve performance, but also mental health for someone maybe going through the loss of a identity, sports complex.
[00:14:34] Speaker C: You know, I would say a broad umbrella of, of mindfulness is a good place to start. And I like to define mindfulness as just a way to get in touch with your emotional side. It looks like a lot of different things for different people. Right. For some, this could look like paced breathing. For some, this could look like some sort of, you know, meditative practice or body awareness or even physical activity can be a form of mindfulness. Right. How do we, how do we get you in Touch with that side of yourself, get you more familiar with your emotions, be able to talk about them, you know, in, in a more nuanced way and try to just really start with a basic understanding of yourself and your body.
[00:15:07] Speaker B: Jimmy, it feels like your, your practice or a lot of who you work with are evolved athletes, like people who have maybe made their athletics a true part of their identity. Right. But they all started in the same place that tens of thousands, if not hundreds of thousands of youth start at, right. In, in early youth sports. So I'm curious, do you see things in youth sports right now that are leading to this or that cause you other concerns?
[00:15:35] Speaker C: Oh, yeah, this could probably be a whole show in, of itself. Right. But you know, the, the youth sports culture has a lot of benefits, right? The, I think the benefits of sports are well documented and most of the reason we all get involved with them in one way, shape or form, but many drawbacks, especially now in 2026. Right. I think we're, we're seeing a rise in things like early specialization, kind of year round sport training, which actually has a detrimental effect on a lot of skill development, especially mental skill development.
Right. We're just seeing all this pressure from such a young age. I mean, with nil recruiting, we're seeing, you know, offers in grade school creeping younger and younger. There's a number of different pressures that really transform sport from something that hopefully should be, you know, enjoyable, a way to build skills and to enjoy life and activities with others and friends, to something that can oftentimes cause more stress, anxiety and burnout than it otherwise intended to.
[00:16:29] Speaker B: I mean, look, I think the short answer is they all want these young people to be successful, right? So, I mean, what are we getting wrong with trying to help these young people be successful in sports?
[00:16:41] Speaker C: I agree with that. And my counter to that is how do we define success is what do we call that? So I think success for a lot of folks looks very straightforwardly like winning, like advancing, like maybe getting the highest scholarship to the best school or making the highest level AAU team. And hey, for some kids, maybe that helps drive them, maybe that helps them reach higher levels of success. Right? But I think for a lot it just places a lot of pressure and puts the focus on things that maybe don't ultimately drive fulfillment, happiness, the whole reason they got involved with the sport in the first place. Right. And yeah, I work with a lot of younger athletes and a lot of times, hey, we're, we're talking about their anxieties and hopes and dreams for sport. But at the same time, we're talking about the parents hopes and dreams and expectations that. That gets informed by their own athletic experience. Right. Years ago. So there, there's just. It's a multilayered experience. Um, so what I would like to see is, you know, like, maybe thinking a little bit more about, hey, what are our goals here?
[00:17:40] Speaker A: Well, a balance of recognition too, you know what I mean? Like, I. There's plenty of people who, they hit a home run and their dad won't stop talking to every person who will listen about they hit a home run and. But they paint a picture and dad's like, oh, cool, thanks. You know, and they put it down, you know, so it's about also being excited for, you know, your kids to do things more than sports is probably going to help be helpful. So what is your message to, like, parents? What can they do better?
[00:18:06] Speaker C: You know, I think a lot of it starts with, like, listening. Right. And observing and just paying attention. Right. Like you said, if, hey, and for some kids, when they hit a home run, that to them is, is the best thing they can do. That's the highest level of achievement. So, yeah, let's, let's enforce that. Let's validate that. Let's. Let's shine a light of success on that. But for many, it might not be right or, you know, what they're looking to their parents for is oftentimes support and, you know, kind of when things maybe go wrong, that kind of support work. It's not just when things are going well. So the idea is we want to try to understand our kids and really what's important to, you know, try to develop that, grow that, validate that in a way that's, you know, psychologically more healthy.
[00:18:42] Speaker B: Hey, J.B. i've got a couple of thoughts here from former guests we've had on Chris Cleveland, who one of our earliest guests. I've heard him say once before how focused he is when his kids were growing up on when they did something great, going and telling them how excited and proud he was of them. But he found that he was only doing it in those moments rather than when there were struggles really going in and saying how proud you are of your child. Like when they clearly struck out three times in three at best.
[00:19:14] Speaker A: Yeah, right.
[00:19:15] Speaker B: Or whatever.
[00:19:15] Speaker C: Oh, a hundred percent.
And it, it dives back into, like, what are our goals? What is success? If your goal is only athletic achievement, it's going to create some conflict. Right. You're going to set up false expectations. And the only way maybe Then for a kid to achieve, you know, dad's approval is by hitting a home run.
That's a, that's a hard bargain. Right?
[00:19:35] Speaker A: That's Jimmy Pierce. All really date me. Yeah.
[00:19:39] Speaker B: You have dated yourself.
[00:19:41] Speaker A: I don't remember him. I just know his story.
[00:19:45] Speaker B: And then the other one that I had in my mind JB was Joy Yule, who talked about, you know, being an expert, like being really, really focused in one area and being sort of the savant in that. That kind of goes against this concept of multiple interests. Right.
[00:20:02] Speaker A: There's certainly no balance there. If you're just trying to be, hey, I'm going to be the.
Going to know everything there is to know about the Blue Whale. It's like, all right, man, but like there's a lot of other things out
[00:20:10] Speaker B: there, but that translates to sports. Right? Like you're trying to be Tiger woods or trying to be Tony Gwynn or trying to be whoever.
If you're, if all eggs are in one basket, Jimmy. I'm assuming, I'm assuming it's high risk, high reward on the mental health status.
[00:20:26] Speaker C: Yeah, for sure. The, the kind of sentinel book in this field is by David Epstein. It's called Range.
And he actually starts the book off by highlighting a couple examples. And one is Roger Federer, who grew up basically playing almost every sport imaginable. I think he said he played nine or 10 sports as a kid.
[00:20:43] Speaker A: Wow.
[00:20:43] Speaker C: Yeah. And just kind of the lessons from that about all the, not only the fine motor skills and the kind of different hand eye coordination techniques, especially as a young kid that are so important, but all the other social mental skills you get as being part of a team or individual sports or just different environments. We want kids to be able to learn from that, then pull from that when eventually they do, you know, specialize if that's best for them down the road.
[00:21:07] Speaker A: Like you'll like what Chipper Jones is doing right now. Chipper does that with his kids. He's like, look, we travel during the summer, we're doing family things. They play four sports, they play baseball in the spring, then they switch and they do other couple of sports. Like that's what I did and I was just fine. So, like, they'll be fine.
[00:21:24] Speaker B: Let me give you the counter to that, okay.
Because when you talk about Roger Federer, you talk about unbelievable, God given physical talents. Right. They're playing three other sports. It's harder for the 5, 9 kid to catch up over the 6, 5 kid. That has to come into play with a lot of parents. I would assume, Jimmy. And especially with a lot of these young, young kids who want to make it.
[00:21:46] Speaker C: Oh, for sure.
[00:21:46] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:21:47] Speaker C: And then I think then the conversation becomes, then when is the time to specialize? Right now maybe, you know, you develop those skills early. And I still think that cross sport training is important for skill development.
Maybe somebody who, you know, has a little bit more to overcome in the physical department, maybe specialize, maybe then a bit more early. Right. I think that makes sense.
So it's probably, you know, kind of an individual discussion, but I still think there's value, especially early on in youth sports where we need to still cross train.
[00:22:13] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:22:13] Speaker A: And all the way back to full
[00:22:15] Speaker B: disclosure, jb before everybody thinks I was a terrible father.
My daughter played multiple sports. My son played football, basketball, baseball, soccer. Okay, so I wasn't a terrible.
[00:22:26] Speaker A: You did the Chipper Jones thing.
[00:22:27] Speaker B: Terrible guy. You know, just to lay it out
[00:22:30] Speaker A: there, but just want everyone to know I stopped playing soccer real early because I was like, this is dumb.
But when you have all this sort of going on in the, in the sports and shifting, how does that all play into, you know, it's all in your head when you're, when you're starting to get nervous. Is. Does the, the cross promotion of different sports and different activities, things sort of help you to stay out of your head in those negative ways?
[00:22:54] Speaker C: Yeah, for sure. I mean, it kind of. You build up a skill set, right? You build up a more diverse, well rounded skill set. That, that probably makes you more resilient, right. You've probably encountered different challenges, right, in different sports.
You know, it's not just kind of the same challenge over and over again. So that when you do get a curveball, right? And in more ways than one, you're able to pull from different things and different experiences. I think that makes a lot of sense also just on a very, you know, to even move away from the mental side real quick, just physically, right. We look at, at the rise of Tommy John, surgeries of, you know, in basketball, a lot more Achilles tears and things like that. And you got to wonder, right, is some of this due to kind of this hyper specialization?
And in a weird way, I think that kind of parallels the mental side as well, where maybe we're seeing more burnout, higher rates of certain mental conditions as a result of this hyper specialization,
[00:23:39] Speaker B: if our goal 10 years from now is to have healthier athletes, healthier former athletes, you know, people that transition from a sports identity to, you know, another, you know, some other identity, you know, as a part of Their life. What do we need to change about youth sports culture today to improve the health of these young athletes for their future lives?
[00:24:01] Speaker C: Yeah, it's a, it's kind of the million dollar question. Right. And I think it, it starts with conversations like this. It starts with awareness. I think that's still ultimately the, the one tool that's going to break the stigma down the most.
But I really think the structural side needs to change as well. So we think about, you know, where does funding come from and could more funding be allocated towards mental health support?
Right. What does, you know, what does mental health education look like in youth sports? You know, I, I previously I've trained at different facilities, worked with a lot of different teams, and it's always striking. You ask athletes, you know, say you or someone you know is struggling with a mental health challenge, you know, who would you turn to or like, who would you go talk to? Very few have an immediate answer. Right. So I think it's, it's raising awareness of, of not only who is in place, it's, it's increasing the number of providers and then it's increasing the awareness of athletes. Hey, here is your point person, right? If, you know, let's, let's set up a structure that actually incentivizes people to, to seek out treatment.
[00:24:55] Speaker B: Yeah, you, you, you, you kind of transition very nicely there into the natural question of, for an athlete who's listening right now, who's struggling, what's the natural thing you would tell them to do?
[00:25:07] Speaker C: I would say to seek out the individual in this world maybe, or who in whatever orbit you have that you trust the most.
In my work, I, I have to establish trust as the number one, you know, kind of feature of any relationship, because unless you trust somebody, you're not going to be vulnerable with them enough to, to share what's bothering you and turn to that person that could be a parent, a coach, a friend, a mental health provider, whoever it is, and, you know, seek that support early. Unfortunately, like I said, a vast majority of my calls are after some sort of negative outcome or negative event. Let's try to bump that up a little bit. Let's recognize the warning signs, let's try to pick up on maybe subtle pattern shifts and then really, you know, find who you trust and encourage you to seek help through that person.
[00:25:53] Speaker B: Yeah, I think the good news about what we've seen publicly at least, is that the stigma of this being a weakness is changing a little bit. So hopefully anybody that's listening to this right now, that's Struggling doesn't see it as a weakness, but sees it as the ability to advance themselves into a healthier lifestyle. So, Jimmy, you've given all of our listeners tons of food for thought.
This was very relevant for me, you know, and my family and in our lives and for all of our listeners today, whether they're athletes or not. I think they gained a lot from you and your generosity. So I really appreciate you joining us today.
[00:26:32] Speaker C: Of course. Thank you very much. You know, being an athlete is a state of mind, right. That never really leaves you. So glad I was able to hopefully help and appreciate you guys having me on today.
[00:26:42] Speaker B: Jb, One thing I really liked about this conversation with Jimmy is that it naturally connected back to a few episodes we've already done, especially with Chris, Cleveland and Enjoy Yule and. Oh, yeah, I. I think that says something about why we're still having these conversations. You know, on the surface, this episode is about athletes, mental health, pressure, or identity.
And the worst advice being it's all in your head. But underneath that, you know, you peel back the layers. It's the same universal truth we keep running into on this show is that advice is never just advice. It depends on who's hearing it when they're hearing it, and what they're already carrying when it gets said to them.
[00:27:21] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. And Jimmy's point about athletes really applies, you know, like you said, way beyond sports. Like, everybody has a version of this, right? Maybe it's not baseball or college athletics, but somebody tells you, hey, stop thinking about this so much. You're overthinking it. You're overdoing it. Like, don't. Don't. Don't worry about it so much. And people think, well, okay, I just won't. It's like when somebody's anxious and you tell them, oh, just don't be anxious. It's like, no, I. I would rather not. I just don't know how to do that. Someone takes something that's actually fairly complicated and makes you feel like you're just not handling it in the right way.
[00:27:53] Speaker B: Yeah, exactly. And that's what I thought was so strong about this episode. No matter your background, you can pull something from this conversation. And every one of the conversations I mentioned, Chris's episode, Joy's episode, they're all different stories, but they're circling the same idea. Good advice has to leave room for the full person.
[00:28:13] Speaker A: Yes, absolutely. And obviously, we definitely dated ourselves with our baseball references in this one with Chuck Knobloch and Steve Sachs, Jimmy Pearsall, I think Chipper Jones was the youngest person that we talked about. So thank God Jimmy was here to hit us with all the Gen Z references.
[00:28:29] Speaker B: Yeah, that, that's absolutely true. Just another reason why he was such a good guest. We we otherwise lose our younger listeners for a minute, which, you know, these days when younger listeners lose you for a minute, you've lost them for good. But hope we got them back there at the end.
[00:28:44] Speaker A: Yeah. At least their dads were very locked in.
[00:28:48] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, yeah, for sure. That's what I'm looking to grow is the dad audience out there. Right. But yeah, either way, big thanks to Jimmy, Molly for joining us and thank you to Smith and Howard for helping us continue to bring you these great conversations every week. Come back next week wherever you get your podcast for another episode of the Worst Advice I Ever Got.
