Don't Make White People Music

[00:00:05] Speaker A: Hey, everybody, and welcome to the worst advice I ever got. I'm your host, Sean Taylor, joined by my producer, JB. And we're here to ask our guests to share the worst advice they ever got. Today we're talking with Lanray. Lanray is a breakout singer songwriter who broken eight records, calls sharp, charming, and wonderfully fresh. Lanre blends r and b, electronic and pop to create catchy, heartfelt hits. And with over a million streams on Spotify alone, he's clearly doing well in redefining the genre. Lanre, it is great to have you with us today. [00:00:41] Speaker B: Hi, Sean. Glad to be here. [00:00:43] Speaker C: Thank you. [00:00:43] Speaker D: Thanks. Tell us about the worst advice you ever got. [00:00:48] Speaker B: So, the worst advice I ever got was don't make white people music. [00:00:53] Speaker D: Okay, let's get into some context here a little bit. What do you think that meant? [00:01:01] Speaker B: So, first off, I want to say I think it came from a loving place. I think you can hear some of the harshest critiques and advice from people you love the most. And I think what it meant was there's an opportunity as a nigerian American to make this kind of, you know, there's a renaissance and aphrobeast going on right now. So he saw an opportunity for me to capitalize on that versus what I freshly was doing at that point in time was making my own interpretation of what pop music meant to me and what my sort of, like, interpretation of that was. [00:01:40] Speaker C: Well, who gave you the advice? [00:01:42] Speaker B: It was my older cousin who I've known since I was ten. I say that because he was married into the family. So we have this thing in black culture. You call everybody a cousin, even though he's kind of an in law kind of thing. So he's a very successful producer in the music industry, and he's sort of gave me my start in songwriting. I literally started songwriting because of him. And I owe a lot of my introduction to the music industry to him. So his words have a lot of weight. [00:02:14] Speaker D: It felt like he intended it to. [00:02:16] Speaker A: Be a little bit of a jolt. [00:02:18] Speaker D: Or a little shocking. [00:02:19] Speaker A: Did it feel that way? [00:02:20] Speaker B: 100%. It was definitely. He's the type of person where there's no filter. He kind of just says what's on his mind, especially if he's passionate about it. So add on top of the fact that he's in this music industry, he's known me since I was a little kid, so it's double whammy type of thing. I was just pulling into Walgreens, getting my groceries for this two month trek that I'm about to be on, and I was stopped in the tracks. I mean, it really was like a record scratch. Cause I put so much financial investment in this. I put so much emotional investment in this. I said goodbye to my friends and family in Atlanta, and I was like, hey, I'm gonna do this thing, and you're seeing me in real time. I told my fans on Instagram and everything. So to hear that in that moment where I'm probably the most insecure of the whole trip, I literally, I was in the walking parking lot. I remember I was in my rental car, and I didn't cry. But you know, when you're about to start crying, that's how I felt. [00:03:20] Speaker D: I thought to myself, as you said it, how would I have responded to that? And I would think I would question myself, did it make you do that? [00:03:28] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, 100%. So the person I called right after that happened was my brother. And he's someone that I call when I feel that questionable, like, what am I doing? Kind of situation. And I remember saying, do you think I'm making a huge mistake? And thinking back on that question now, I'm like, was I questioning the pop music thing or was I questioning my whole career? I felt the whole weight of it in that moment. [00:03:58] Speaker D: I can still tell you're a young man, so it hasn't been that long since you got the advice. How'd you process it? [00:04:04] Speaker B: I think I processed it by acknowledging first, acknowledging that it came from a place of love. Because in the music industry, you're hearing all kinds of stuff like that all the time. Right. But historically, in the past, I've kind of been the kind of person where, okay, if you tell me to go right, I'm going to go right for you. If you tell me to go left, I'm going to go left for you. Super people pleasing tendencies. Until very recently, I've been going to therapy and sort of reeling myself back in. So my process for that really was going back to the way I used to be. Maybe like the 14 year old kid that this guy used to usher into the music industry. But then I had to quickly bring myself back to my 30 year old self and say, hey, what is really happening here? [00:04:55] Speaker D: Yeah. [00:04:55] Speaker C: When did you realize that it was bad advice? [00:04:59] Speaker B: I realized it was bad advice because I had to think about the context in which he was telling me that, yes, he's my relative, but hasn't really been involved in my day to day life. He knew that I was taking the music industry seriously, and I was working on my career. So he didn't have the context for what he actually said. So once I realized that part, I was like, okay, this is something that he could have literally said to anybody. Like, if you're just looking at my instagram feed and you see I'm nigerian, you hear the kind of music that I'm putting out there. He wasn't with me when I was first developing this sound where I was workshopping it, and I was sending demos to different producers and things like that and getting the feedback and putting in the actual work that took to get here. So I think for me, it was realizing in myself, like, hey, you also have an authoritative voice in this industry, especially when it comes to my own music. And it took that winding back and realizing, okay, no, no, no. What I'm doing is actually, it's not just something I'm just doing Willy nilly. Like, go to LA. Go there for two months. There was a plan behind this. There was a passion behind it. There's a story behind it that he didn't know. And again, I don't blame him for that. Cause he wasn't there. But also, I'm not gonna take his word as Bible, because it's not. [00:06:30] Speaker D: When someone who has made it gives us advice and it turns out to. [00:06:35] Speaker A: Be bad, wow, that advice still has. [00:06:38] Speaker D: To have lasting impact. [00:06:39] Speaker B: And, Sean, I think you would relate to this, too. When you're starting something new, especially in the creative realm, there's so much insecurity that comes baked into it. Just as an industry. [00:06:50] Speaker D: I'm totally right there right now. I'm a CPA doing a podcast. I'm as insecure right now as I can possibly be. [00:06:57] Speaker B: Yeah, there's so much uncertainty. Right. So that's already baked into it. And then add on to the fact, yes, it's a blessing that I have someone like that in my family that I can always use as a resource. But there's also things like this that can happen where they can tell me things that can really stick with me. You know, I'd love to say, like, oh, I completely moved on from the situation, and I don't think about it at all, but I'm here on this podcast talking about it, obviously. Yeah, it affects me a good bit, you know, and it's, you know, we said that to put the familial stuff aside, but I think that's, like, a really important thing, especially in my family, because we're all so close, you know, and he knows my story so well up until, like, the last few years. So I gave him a lot of weight. [00:07:46] Speaker D: Yeah, I totally can relate to that. And it makes sense. [00:07:50] Speaker A: Did you adopt the advice for a little while and then learn it was bad? [00:07:54] Speaker B: Yeah. So it's actually a funny story. So I was out there to complete the rest of my ep project that is releasing this year, and the whole lane that I was going was a lane that he was sort of critiquing me about. So I had all these songs. I had about, like, five to six songs I was gonna complete with my producer there. And I remember in my head, I was like, okay, how do I infuse some afrobeats into this? How do I take the good of what he said and actually take it constructively? And there was a moment that I was in my Airbnb that I was like, what are you doing? What are you doing? It's totally fine to develop songs and things like that, but that didn't come from me. That came from an outside source that's telling me, hey, this is what the audience, the black audience, is gonna want from you. I heard this podcast Jay Shetty, he had on Rick Rubin, and Rick Rubin, he said, when you're making art, you should never focus on the perception of the fans, because literally, you do not know. We don't know who the fans are gonna be of this podcast. Right? I didn't know at the time who the fans, even though I knew. Okay, yes, this kind of music historically fits with this type of audience, but I don't know that he doesn't know. If I do afrobeats music, who is gonna really reach or affect, you know, and this is my art. This is something that I want to do. So I can't let that negative or not even negative, but that constructive feedback inform this. This is gonna be what it's gonna be, period. [00:09:35] Speaker D: It's interesting somebody didn't ultimately tell you it was bad advice. [00:09:39] Speaker A: You yourself figured out it was bad advice, right? [00:09:42] Speaker D: Which I don't think is always the case. I think many times people will see someone doing something and say, why are you doing that? And you say, well, someone told me I should do it. And they help you figure out you had to journey through this on your own and through your creative process, say, I don't like this, and what are you doing? Like yourself, what are you doing? That's really an amazing story. [00:10:04] Speaker B: Thank you. [00:10:06] Speaker D: What does it mean to your music today? [00:10:08] Speaker B: It's definitely made me more sure of myself in a weird way. And I almost doubled down on the fact that, hey, if I'm gonna make, quote unquote, white people music. I'm gonna do it the best anybody's ever done it. [00:10:21] Speaker C: I'm gonna make the whitest music in the world. [00:10:23] Speaker B: Exactly. Exactly. I'm gonna double down. Cause if that's what you're hearing, I might as well make it good, right? And it's been. The whole creative process of this specific project has been transformative to me as a person as well. Like, that's one story about it. And there's been a lot of different pieces since that summer that have just confirmed to me, like, hey, you're on the right track here, you know? [00:10:49] Speaker D: Yeah. Yeah. It would seem to me, as someone who's in a creative endeavor, that reinforcement is even more critical. [00:10:58] Speaker B: So, like, the example I gave before about not knowing and you shouldn't create art based on fan expectation, I think a part two of that would be. But when you do get the fan response right. And again, as I'm sure you know, you need to take that feedback very seriously, because that kind of informs the different decisions that you make once the art is made. [00:11:23] Speaker D: That's tremendous. [00:11:24] Speaker C: There's a lot of energy and time that goes into music careers in general at any time. I mean, now, especially with how much you need to be on every channel and all of these things, you're kind of always judging yourself. You upload a picture, it only gets 30 likes. Like, oh, no. Like, what have I done wrong? So, you're always kind of second guessing yourself. Is this. Does this advice kind of sit with you when you post a song? And maybe it doesn't do what you wanted it to do? And you're like, he was right. [00:11:49] Speaker B: I think of the metaphor of, like, an echo chamber. Like, you can't hear it as well as you did the first time, but it's always kind of there. So I would say that conversation, anytime something doesn't go the way I want, I can hear the echoes of it. And I'm just now realizing that now because there's so many times where I'm like, yeah, I really love this thing, and I put it out there. And when I don't get that feedback that I may have expected, I'm like, okay, maybe he was a little right. Maybe I should pivot. [00:12:25] Speaker D: Yeah. [00:12:25] Speaker A: So the worst advice you ever got. [00:12:28] Speaker D: And, you know, it's the worst advice you ever got, still has impact, still comes back. Still, sometimes you question it. It's almost like you have to reevaluate it in points in time going forward. That's very unique. [00:12:40] Speaker C: We've always yeah, it's still there. It's like, okay, I know it's bad, but I still give it credence. I still think about it. [00:12:48] Speaker D: That's a dynamic we've not heard on this podcast yet. How do you expect you will advise young, aspiring artists in their careers? [00:13:00] Speaker B: So one of the biggest things that I've learned in the music industry and that I can give as advice to people who are younger than me are, yes, listen to people. Hear them out when they give their feedback or advice, but don't let that stop you from what you're doing. And that, because that is so important, because we've never heard your voice before. I'm talking to, like, this metaphorical upcoming musician. We've never heard your voice. We've never heard how you interpret the world and your creative vision and none of that. So it'd be a huge detriment to the world, not even just yourself, if you stopped what you're doing or pivoted or did something other than what your vision is. And that's so hard. It's way easier for me to say than it is to do because I've experienced it. It's almost like you have to train yourself to say, hey, I have to keep going. Despite my. Maybe your family doesn't believe in you. Maybe you don't really have a lot of fans. Maybe it's taking a lot longer than you expected. So literally, the world is showing you all the signs to stop, but you can't, you know, do you think that. [00:14:20] Speaker C: The advice came from a place of change? Your. I think if you do this, you'll be successful. Just do this. [00:14:28] Speaker B: Yeah. You have to be very careful in the music industry when you give advice like that because you're in a silo of things that are working in your specific time and place. There are. I mean, you guys know this. There's so many different variations of artists out there, especially today. Imagine if someone looked at Freddie Mercury back then and was like, you are singing really loud. You're gay, and you should suppress it, and you shouldn't have any kind of queer anything on this. And you should be very straight laced. Look at the Beatles. Be like them. We wouldn't have Freddie Mercury. [00:15:01] Speaker D: We wouldn't have it. [00:15:02] Speaker C: Yeah. Wouldn't he be cool? Yeah, I bet he did. I'm sure he did get that advice. [00:15:06] Speaker D: That's a really great point. Think of how many things we wouldn't have today in entertainment or in the business world, so to speak. [00:15:16] Speaker C: It does sound a little bit like you're saying, don't listen to any advice. [00:15:21] Speaker B: So, actually, I'm kind of saying the opposite of that in a way, because I'm saying you should listen to critique. I think critique is one of the most invaluable things you can ever have as a creator because it gives you, like, real time, especially when it comes from fans. When my fans, like, I can see the data of when they don't react to a song well, I'm like, okay, they are active listeners who are saying, uh, this isn't for me. Maybe the next time I will keep that song to myself. Still create it, but I'll keep that song to myself. Cause it's still a product. I think advice is one of the most important things that you can take, but it's also very important as a business owner and a creator to filter it. And that's really hard to do when you're also the person who's driving everything. It's like you're driving in chaos, and you're trying to make sure that the steering wheel is straight at all times. But you also want to make sure that you're getting good feedback, but you don't want that feedback to push you too far off, and then you don't want your own ego and bias to push you so far off the other way. One of the best pieces of advice I ever heard was from Beyonce, and she said, never dilute yourself to be approved or to please other people. Keep doing what you're doing, and the. [00:16:44] Speaker A: World will catch up in a relationship. [00:16:47] Speaker D: When the talking ceases. When the feedback ceases, that's the worst it can be. So it's really very interesting for you to look at it from that perspective. [00:16:53] Speaker B: I totally agree, and I think with that, that is how, you know, like, if you don't get any feedback at all and you're kind of talking into this void, that's how, you know you need to pivot. That, I think, is the biggest indication of, like, use your time doing something else, because you're not getting any kind of emotional response from anybody. [00:17:16] Speaker D: Yeah. So if it doesn't elicit feedback, you're probably not operating at your highest and best use or in your right environment. [00:17:23] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:17:24] Speaker D: That's an interesting vantage point. If you were talking to your cousin. [00:17:28] Speaker A: Today, what would you tell him about. [00:17:30] Speaker D: That advice that you got and how it impacted you? [00:17:34] Speaker B: I would tell him that what you said was a sound thought at the time, but the application of it wasn't accurate for my career and my life. [00:17:48] Speaker C: Have you ever said that to him? [00:17:50] Speaker B: No. [00:17:50] Speaker C: No. Well, maybe he'll listen. [00:17:52] Speaker B: Yeah, I hope so. [00:17:53] Speaker A: Well, what I just heard you say was your advice had validity. [00:17:59] Speaker D: It just wasn't applicable to me, honestly. [00:18:02] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:18:03] Speaker B: I've never even thought about it that way because had he not said that to me at that time, I don't think I would have doubled down as hard as I did with the rest of the project, and then I wouldn't have the product that I have today. So, yeah, in an indirect way, he really helped me out. [00:18:20] Speaker D: That's great. [00:18:21] Speaker A: Well, you've really helped us out today. [00:18:22] Speaker D: By joining us on our episode. Thank you so much for being with us, Lanre. We really appreciate it. [00:18:27] Speaker B: Thank you so much, Sean. [00:18:29] Speaker A: Well, that was really great. [00:18:30] Speaker D: JB. [00:18:31] Speaker A: And I was really impressed with how he took the advice. And unlike what we've talked about with a lot of our guests, he really examined where he thought the advice was coming from. [00:18:42] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:18:42] Speaker E: How that guy kind of came up with that advice and what he might have meant. And anytime we were like, oh, why do you think it was bad? And how was bad? He really brought it back to let me put it in their shoes. And here's what I think they were trying to say. Because when you're ignoring advice from family or from somebody who's successful, you really do have to put yourself in, where is this coming from so that you can feel okay with ignoring it? [00:19:04] Speaker A: As I listened to his story, the advice was coming from a place of, this is probably your quickest path, your path of least resistance to success, so you don't have to be hurt and feel all the scar tissue. But Lanre had to really relate that back to what he really wanted to do. Listen, to critique, it is really valuable to your process. That's what he essentially said. And so often we hear a critique and we just block it out. I saw a stand up routine. Ricky Gervais was talking about just how we are the, you know, the dominant species on the planet, but we're hurt by words. Isn't that funny? Words hurt us. [00:19:49] Speaker E: Yeah, you're going to get a lot of people that say, no, I don't like this. And it's always going to happen. So you have to be really confident in yourself and your decisions that you make when you're going to get those critiques. [00:20:00] Speaker A: And, yeah, well, hopefully our listeners today picked up on some pieces of advice indirectly that will help them figure out what they need to do to continue down the path of who they are authentically for their creative self. [00:20:17] Speaker D: So I'm really happy that Lanre joined us today. [00:20:19] Speaker A: It was a great episode. I'm glad you all listened in today. Please tune in next week and join us again for the worst advice I ever got.